Why Website Flipping Sucks
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There is a big craze going on at the moment that is “Website Flipping”. Website flipping is the act of starting a brand new blog (or buying a smaller one) and making it bigger and worth more money and then selling it on to make a profit.
I have tried website flipping in small doses for the last month. I got caught up in the craze and thought that I would give it a go. Flip a few websites, make a few hundred dollars. I had some successes and some failures and I think I ended up in the negative but that’s not the point. I have discovered that website flipping is not for me. I know I posted quite a bit about how good it was but I have changed my mind.
Here are my reasons why website flipping sucks and why it isn’t for me.
1. No Genuine Connections
I think that when you get to the end of your life you are going to think back on the genuine connections you made with people, not the quick money you earned from flipping websites. When flipping websites you are never around long enough to make any genuine connection with your readers. This is what I want to do and this is why I love blogging so much. People like Yan, Hussein and Ethan are great commentors of this blog and I am building a relationship with them. I love this and website flipping just doesn’t support this.
2. Doesn’t Build
The thing I love about blogs (especially about Smarter Wealth) is that they grow exponentially over time. The bigger they already are the faster they grow. When starting out blogging is hard and you need to push to get readership and it builds really slowly. But as you have more readers you find your blog grows exponentially. If you are website flipping you are always doing the hard yards trying to get new readers when you have no established readership base. Blogging for the long term is better because it builds over time.
3. Market is Overcrowded
Website Flipping has gone mainstream with people like SiteFlipU talking about it and loads of other sites. It appear that every MMO man and his blog is trying out site flipping and this is making the market overcrowded. You used to be able to make a couple of hundreds site flipping for a really basic site (so I am told) but now you will struggle to sell because there are so many people flipping websites.
4. No Reoccuring Income
The best thing about blogs and internet marketing schemes is that they bring you recurring income. The visitors from this blog bring me recurring income from advertising revenues (so thankyou so much for visiting, you are making me rich!). But when you are site flipping you don’t make that revenue every month. You have to work for it by creating another site which is just like having a job. The best thing about being online is you can work less and earn more, in website flipping I have found it can be a lot of work for a return that doesn’t recur.
5. I Don’t Enjoy It
This is truthfully the main reason why I think website flipping sucks. It is not enjoyable. I don’t like doing it. I think it is boring and monotonous and I would rather be doing other things like posting on this blog and marketing this blog. So I don’t want to spend my days doing something I don’t enjoy. I would rather do things which I really enjoy doing and then I will live a much happier life.
So I think website flipping sucks and I won’t be doing it anymore. Sorry if that disappoints anyone. What do you think about website flipping?
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September 23, 2008 am30 12:06 am
I concur, Ryan. Great connections are more important than a quick $100 or so. Also, the money that one can earn through flipping could also be made if he continues to manage the site himself.
Regarding your argument about the market getting crowded, well I can say that you can still earn a good amount of money as long as you do the right thing. The problem with other people is that they expect too much for a very simple site.
Lucass last blog post..Contest Winners
September 23, 2008 am30 12:18 am
Thanks for the shout out, anyway, I’m just trying it and I haven’t started yet blog flipping. I got only a plan but I haven’t decided yet.
Now I know your alternative.. Is it niche sites?
Husseins last blog post..Sunday Link Love #9
September 23, 2008 am30 1:16 am
I agree with about the recurring income issue. Website flipping is a hit or miss, sometimes it’s easy to sell a new site for $250, sometimes it’s a struggle to get $50 for the same kind of site. And as you said it’s a really saturated market, personally I find it hard to compete with Indian webmasters who don’t care about the amount of money they get for a site as long as it’s sold for more than $30. No offense, but it’s the truth.
September 23, 2008 am30 2:13 am
I have read all your articles about site flipping. It seemed like a cool concept and was interesting to read about, but it was never something I planned on doing… or thought that I could do successfully.
If I put my heart, soul, creativity, and hard work into something, I could never just let it go. Even if the profit was incredible. I think keeping the blog and going all out on it is a better long term goal. Both for traffic and for revenue.
But hey, any way to make income while sitting in front of your computer in your pajamas is better than a real job
- Jack Rugile
Simple Sapien
September 23, 2008 am30 4:06 am
Hi man,
Came here via Hussein’s… Sounds like flipping is catching up. However, are there any proper blog valuation sites to estimate the sale price?
Would like to know how much mine can be sold at
Cheers,
Ajith
PS: I like your banner
Ajith Edasserys last blog post..I am not John Chow, still…
September 23, 2008 am30 4:12 am
It’s a shame to lose a potential website flipper. You brought up some good points and I have yo say I agree with them except the last one. I do really enjoy flipping websites and I have been able to find ways to get some reccuring income such as hosting fees and such.
September 23, 2008 am30 5:07 am
For me, everything I do on my blog is just a game of trial and errors and site flipping may just be another experiment for me.
Seriously I’m too sure if it sucks or otherwise but I’m pretty sure that you can’t build the relationship (connection) long enough by flipping one site after the other.
Anyway, thanks for the shout, buddy. I’m surprised you still remember me though I haven’t been really active in your blog the last couple of days.
Yan
September 23, 2008 am30 5:48 am
What I really don’t like about website flipping is it feels like you are ripping people with very little experience off.
Why? Because most of these new blogs that are sold will NEVER make the money to cover the cost they paid for the site, and that’s because these people are novices with not enough information in this sector to ever make a go of a brand new site.
Oh and I agree it’s just plain boring! Now ppc marketing that’s a lot more fun
September 23, 2008 am30 5:57 am
I enjoy flipping websites. I’ve flipped my first 2 sites successfully and made a little profit. I am working on a blog focused on flipping websites right now and will most likely try and flip that for a bit of money.
September 23, 2008 am30 6:06 am
I don’t agree, Ryan.
Site flipping is fun, exciting and can be very $$$ rewarding! Blogging can be monotonous, not very $$$ rewarding and get old.
The “going rate” for a site flip is 24-36 times monthly income if the site has a steady history for a year. A sales site earning $3K a month could sell for $72K, plus you made $36K in sales over the year. That’s $108K income!
How many bloggers can do that much income?
That site-flip scenario can be done with a new site every year.
What if you were running 2 sites like that every year? It keeps you busy, gives you a huge goal and keeps you motivated.
My best site-flip was only $4K but the site was brand new, had no traffic or sales. I had to sell it b/c I needed the money.
I put one of the ebooks I wrote on the site and sold all rights to the ebook & the site. The ebook had about $3,600.00 in sales on a forum. That’s why it brought in $4K.
L8er,
Dan
September 23, 2008 am30 4:04 pm
Seems like a lot of work for little payoff…I guess one out of XX makes you some decent cash, but in the long run I like the reoccurring income a content rich blog can produce. Your work can actually decrease as your income increases in some cases…just my two cents.
Matt
September 23, 2008 am30 4:39 pm
I think that you are not gonna be millionare on flipping sites
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September 23, 2008 am30 5:02 pm
Seems that there is a conflict of interest here. At the top of your home page (as of this writing) I see “Why Website Flipping Sucks” on one side and an e-book for “Flipping Websites for Profit” on the other.
September 23, 2008 am30 6:59 pm
Many bloggers are now talking about site flipping, but I haven’t try it.
September 23, 2008 am30 7:07 pm
@ Lucas - I think I have been one of those people who expected too much from a crappy (simple) website. Meh
@ Hussein - I am about to try niche sites (I have one in the works) but I haven’t started making moeny from it yet. I am either going to go niche sites or selling products…leaning towards products at the moment
@ Simple Sapien - I concur to the sitting in pyjamas working online. Me and my fiance are trying to work it now now so I can afford to do this full time (because in the long run it will make us a lot of money)
@ Yan - Yan you are the man. Thanks for coming back and commenting…love your comments. Always worthwhile…and your avatar picture is so proffessional and soft on the eyes
@ Clog - This is so true. I once sold I justin timberlake fan site to a novice and although he only paid $70 for it I doubt it will do any good in the long run :-S
@ Ethan - Haha flipping websites about flipping websites. I have one of these… I bought the domain http://www.flippinwebsites.com if you want it I will sell it to you. How much have you made from your two flips?
@ Matt - I agree reuccuring income is way better. Look at JohnChow. He makes $30,000-$40,000 per month. It would be hard to make that website flipping
@ Kevin - Definately I think it is unlikely to be a millionaire website flipping. But it could happen if you flipped a website like myspace or facebook
@ James (my comment competitor ;-)) - Haha I know I do have a conflict of interest. I wrote a great ebook which I give away for free, yet now I hate website flipping. What shall I do?
September 24, 2008 am30 12:04 am
I really agree with this.. I tried flipping several times but didn’t get much. my last one was only just 30$
then I quit.
September 24, 2008 am30 12:09 am
@ Ajith - Yeh you can list your blog on http://www.sitepoint.com and see how much it goes for. As opposed to that you can’t REALLY know how much a blog is worth because sometimes you get a keen buyer and sometimes you don’t…another reason why I hate it…because it is so up in the air
@ Justin - If you enjoy it then do it. This is a post about why I don’t like flipping websites. If you like it then go for it
@ Domain Names - Well I have to disagree with you. If you can build 2 sites per year which earn $3,000 per month in 4 years you could be earning $24,000/month which is $288,000 per year EVERY YEAR. And plus it is so much hard work to get a blog from 0 to $3,000 a month it is much easier to stick with a blog which makes you that much money as blogs grow exponentially
September 24, 2008 am30 1:15 am
LMAO. I think this is hilarious. I’m glad that you think it sucks, more cash for me!
And isn’t it kind of hypocritical to say that website flipping sucks, and that it’s not a smart way to make money… and then offer a website flipping guide as a bonus for people that sign up for your opt-in newesletter?
I’ve got more, but I’ll reply on my blog
September 24, 2008 am30 1:32 am
If it’s sucks, why you make an ebook about it and issued on forum? And you are the suggest anybody to work on flipping website… I guess that you didn’t success with your flipping…
Anyway, domain flipping much excited than web flipping… I make double profit with that
wowos last blog post..Considering Header Page Function
September 24, 2008 am30 1:59 am
Here you go Ryan. My response.. http://siteflipu.com/why-some-people-will-never-make-money-online/
September 24, 2008 am30 2:06 am
Maybe changing the title to: “Flipping Websites for Profit (but it sucks)”
September 24, 2008 am30 5:43 am
I never understood why people would want to sell their hard work. Especially for a few bucks you could make with that. And I never understood why people would buy such a site either, a lot of the work would have to be done again any way.
Olivier - mindmoviess last blog post..5 Tips to get the most out of your brainwave meditation session.
September 24, 2008 am30 8:13 am
Your opinion on website flipping can’t be taken seriously.
There are a few reasons for that, but two of the main reasons are…
ONE: Your latest post is how website flipping sucks….
yet, your “free ebook to subscribers” is “Website Flipping For Profits”. lol
TWO: Your points are all from the perspective of someone who tried and failed without learning why you failed and then attempting to do it right.
I have to comment on each point individually, because you are misleading your readers with a few of them.
I’ve made several thousands on flipping websites and although I’m not a bona fide expert, I can provide your readers with a little insight on the areas where you’ve misguided them in this article:
NUMBER 1: No Genuine Connections?
This couldn’t be further from the truth. Maybe you say this because you’ve only tried to flip a few sites and gave up when you failed, or maybe because you’re just not great at networking with customers.
However, I have made several “real connections” from my buyers who have become “friends”. I stay in contact with 6 out of my last 10 buyers on a regular basis. 5 of them are internet mareketers who make a living online.
Now, I don’t have to list all my sites publicly on Sitepoint because I have regular buyers waiting in the wings.
On top of that, networking with bloggers is awesome, but developing a network behind the scenes that is a “paying customer base” is how you make money (whether that’s buying sites, selling ebooks, or driving an ice cream truck).
NUMBER 2: You’re right that it doesn’t build, hence the word “flip”. However, it also takes you a LOT longer to make “the same” money on a brand new site if you’re a newbie, and for most, that’s the purpose of flipping - cash flow while the other sites build to high passive income.
Website flipping should be one aspect of your game, and if you want to make a consistent living online, you need to have your eggs in more than one basket.
(whether that’s website flipping or something else)
In addition to that, who ever said you have to flip a site within it’s first month? week? day? You can let it build until it’s making revenue and then flip it for a year’s worth of future income. Invest that money into something else. There are about 15 more scenarios under the umbrella of “website flipping”.
NUMBER 3: You so obvious you’re wrong, so I’m not even going to debate “oversaturation”.
All someone has to do is view the marketplace. This statement is always coming from someone who dosn’t know what they’re talking about. Sites sell for their BIN every day. It’s a tad overcrowded with “crappy sites”, but if you sell quality, you’ll have no problem.
NUMBER 4: Can’t earn recurring income?
Again, because you barely know the basics of site flipping, I can see why you said this, but it shouldn’t be passed on to readers.
There are tons of ways to make recurring income from site flips. Back end sales to your customers, and sales you made while the site was yours are just two off the top of my head that can be quite lucrative.
NUMBER 5: You don’t enjoy it? Valid point. I can’t argue with you there. lol.
I’m going to read your ebook now on Flipping Websites For Profit and maybe I’ll do a review.
Cheers dude!
Jay
September 24, 2008 am30 8:44 am
Ryan, great post for a heated and informative debate.
I’m with SuiteJ on this one, and he’s pretty much said what I was going to say in a more detailed fasion.
Regarding making connection, on my last 2 site flips I have made connections for future private sales from these people, even as far as them requesting me to build niche blogs/sites in certain markets for them.. you can’t get more better than that!
I disagree with the market being overcrowded because there are more sites other than sitepoint where buying and selling websites are going on… If anything the MMO niche is what’s saturated, and it even shows on the site flip marketplace with crap being sold everyday.
I actually build blogs, establish them, get them indexed and on the top spot on google, and then sell them.. so I’m not selling a static website, but rather a fully loaded wordpress blog already filled with content, plugins configured, affiliate integration etc.. my customers can take these blogs and begin to have the satisfaction from their future readership and connections in that niche.. it’s a beautiful thing.
You can earn recurring income, and quite often people do forget to change the affiliate links - it’s not exactly projected, but it’s still recurring.
If you don’t enjoy it anymore, then don’t do it - you’re super talented and that shouldn’t be going to waste.
Change your ebook too! lol
Great post.
Elijahs last blog post..5 Easy Ways To Increase The Value Of Your Site Flip
September 24, 2008 am30 8:55 am
I think that it wouldn’t give any enjoyment to anyone. I blog about Personal Finance because it’s a subject I love. I couldn’t imagine trying to build something you love only to give it away a month or two later. I also can’t imagine trying to build something you don’t love.
It’s a lose-lose scenario IMO.
September 24, 2008 am30 10:20 am
Interesting post Ryan, I too have been thrown for a loop. For the simple fact that your ebook is about site flipping!
This presents a problem for me. It shows you wrote an ebook about something you weren’t very well versed in.
I’m not a site flipper, never flipped a site in my life, but I know folks that make regular income doing it. I like you, prefer the recurring income. But, I won’t count flipping out.
The whole premise flipping is not to build up a blog like this one. I woldn’t expect you to flip this site…though, you could in the future if you ever wanted to.
We’ve already talked about the oversaturation. That can be said about anything being taught online, but it’s just not true. What it does, is makes everyone who wants to succeed raise the bar on what they produce.
Again, the post was interesting, and I like how you wrote it in a way that encourages discussion.
Keep it up Ryan
Normal Joes last blog post..What Really Goes On At Blog World Expo
September 24, 2008 am30 3:11 pm
This has certainly sparked some interesting comments. As far as website flipping goes, I think that you realistically need to have a 12-16 month time horizon for building traffic and revenue to a point that the site can command a high dollar figure price. There is simply no way to raise the value of a site from in a few weeks or a month. And you have to be able to commit a lot of your time to it - trying to juggle 10 or 20 other sites is just plain folly.
September 24, 2008 am30 7:09 pm
I really don’t agree with this post, and I see great irony in the promotion of your “Website Flipping” even though, you don’t like it?
I’ve flipped blogs before, personally one to “Bryan Clark” of siteflipu and I’ve made a tidy little profit on a blog that I worked on for 2 months.
Be it known that I lost a large amount of money as the pagerank increased, I didn’t know the rules and I learned the hard way but at the end of the day, I made money from something that I did not invest any money in to apart from the hosting costs.
The whole genuine connections argument I do not believe exists. Yes you have SmarterWealth for your main blog, but what’s hard about building the connections for this blog? Even whilst you’re working on one of your niche blogs. Just say for example you had a tree blog, I don’t believe that reader base would migrate to this one in the MMO niche so I believe building up seperate reader bases is an advantage and at the end of the day not having genuine connections on certain blogs is certainly where $$ can be made when you’re raking in the cash from affiliate offers.
No recurring income? I’ve flipped blogs and websites whenever I’ve liked on forums and sitepoint over and over and when I wish to place them on a site. If you’re listing good blogs and you know what you’re doing, you will make money simple as that. If you don’t have substantial about of blogs to flip or small websites, then you will have big gaps in between the websites you sell and that is indeed not recurring income. You have to work hard to promote the websites and sell them off one by one when you can.
The Market is definitely not overcrowded. How many websites are there online? I think that answers that statement. People need information and if your website gives it, then you can sell the website.
Site flipping is about the money to the site creator and at the end of the day they may not be fussed about building the blog for the readers or making it personal, that’s the cold hard truth. They keep the teaching to their personal blogs and make a huge amount of bucks with site flipping.
Anyway if you’re not site flipping anymore, best take down your free eBook because it doesn’t work according to you
Just my 2 cents,
Best wishes.
September 25, 2008 am30 11:08 am
I guess it depends how you look at it but overall it’s not too bad. I mean, I mainly build niche sites because even if I don’t sell it, I can leave it there and do nothing and still make money from Adsense for as long as the site is up and running.
But I guess it’s not for everyone and you’re right, more and more people are getting into it as we speak… then again, if there is demand for it then there will always be sellers… and I don’t mind being a seller!
Jay
September 28, 2008 am30 6:27 am
I enjoy flipping websites. I’ve got many friends focused on flipping websites and making great income always.. they are my idol..hehe
October 2, 2008 am30 10:39 am
Ryan, it seems like your last reason is the one that sticks. You don’t enjoy creating the product.
I can relate to that. I don’t enjoy my current business that I own and know it is time for me to move on.
The think I like about flipping is it can give me steady short term income while I build my business and understanding in blog world.
Not for everyone, but for some people for many different reasons.
I just had to stop by this post because it has caused so much of a stir.
PPPSSSssssstttt, that was a great marketing technique to bring awareness to your site.
October 3, 2008 am30 8:34 pm
Well, website flipping does not suck in my opinion. I know some guys who make a decent living from it. In my country for example the minimum salary for someone with on going collage is like $500 US per month. If you can make at least $30 a day (aprox. $900 per month)just buy sitting home and flipping sites, why not do it. You try and try and try till you made your first sell and profit.
October 9, 2008 am30 7:40 pm
I dont like site fliping much….if you put so much efforts and money (the efforts may be less) then just keep the site with you and in the long term it will earn you more money than by selling it….so im against site flipping
October 14, 2008 am30 4:54 pm
I never site flip and actually i don’t know the meaning of it ehehehe. can someone tell me a simple word about that?. LOL
Escoofields last blog post..First day being a fire fighter
October 16, 2008 am30 9:58 am
“This is not a double Post Look at the date”
@aus hehehe nice! can you tell me how you enjoy it lOl?.. can’t beleive there are your idols lol>…<
Escoofields last blog post..And the Winner Of Weekly Contest Is …..
October 19, 2008 am30 4:27 pm
hey escoofield just check this blog ryan has written some good posts about site flipping
Rahul Jadhavs last blog post..Choosing A Niche For Your Blog
November 16, 2008 am30 9:53 am
aw man i wanted to get more tips on that…
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